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Big-T

Stan As Gm

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galaxytrash said on 11 hours ago:

some may agree....others may not. but i think the best part of this article that i could take out of it was to just calm down a bit and maybe take a step or 2 back from the ledge.

http://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/one-bad-series-shouldnt-mean-massive-changes-for-the-blackhawks/amp/

thx for the read Galaxy

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McMurrayHawkFan said on 1 minute ago:

thx for the read Galaxy

no problemo. nice to see you back.

wish it was under better circumstances. :)

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I did not read the whole thread, so if this a point already made my apologies. We need to be better at face offs. Cannot be a possession team without the puck and the theme of losing face offs was year long. Also, special teams has consistently hurt us. Even in Cup years. 

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McMurrayHawkFan said on 4 hours ago:

I did not read the whole thread, so if this a point already made my apologies. We need to be better at face offs. Cannot be a possession team without the puck and the theme of losing face offs was year long. Also, special teams has consistently hurt us. Even in Cup years. 

bingo!!

we'll be fine.....

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McMurrayHawkFan said on 9 hours ago:

And break up the chemistry with Kane? I'm not sure that would be my choice. We finally, after years, get someone who thinks and plays like 88? They all underachieved this playoff season. 72 likely looks a lot better had the team played better (and scored).

He's got 1 goal in 11 playoff games. And for the most part, he looked non interested in still playing that late in the year. Regular seasons mean nothing to this franchise, the Hawks need to win now, cuz it's not just Toews and Kane, once Keith, Hossa and Seabs start their natural decline, the duo really won't matter much. We have nothing coming to replace them, so we have to strike now. 

When stan said "I have to be better, and I will be better". I truly believe that he was referring to him signing Panera early. He screwed up with that, and the kid proved he's not going to be worth it in the end. With Cap space this team will be alright for the short term, but without it, you'll get a little better result than this year. Too many holes in this team, and I don't mean regular season holes. My fear is the team as is will do much better during the regular season, and still have the same results in the first round, but score more in the first round. We can't wait forever for guys like Panera to show up. Once their paid, they have to play like it, and he clearly isn't worth what he's paid. Take him away from Kane, and his numbers slip. He's too one dimensional to pay that kind of money too!!!

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vipermuscle83 said on On 23/04/2017 at 1:08 PM:

I agree Q has a lot of blame to take here, but who's out there that's an upgrade? I agree there's a shelf life for every coach, but that's evident when the team has started tuning him out. I don't think that's happened yet. I think they still have a lot of respect for Q. I just think they are used to flipping the switch, and they just got a huge slap in the face to tell them otherwise.

I think that last month is on him. Who out there is better? Will see once next year comes. I don't think there is any doubt ( Especially after Kitchen firing) Q is gone without a third round appearance. In fact, I wouldn't put it past Wirtz to fire Bowman if they font get out of the first round next year.

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MapleLeaf89 said on On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 7:31 AM:

I think that last month is on him. Who out there is better? Will see once next year comes. I don't think there is any doubt ( Especially after Kitchen firing) Q is gone without a third round appearance. In fact, I wouldn't put it past Wirtz to fire Bowman if they font get out of the first round next year.

GM's generally get to fire a head coach first before their job is on the line. Q is the only coach Stan has ever had. It flows downhill.

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Big-T said on On 4/26/2017 at 7:12 AM:

He's got 1 goal in 11 playoff games. And for the most part, he looked non interested in still playing that late in the year. Regular seasons mean nothing to this franchise, the Hawks need to win now, cuz it's not just Toews and Kane, once Keith, Hossa and Seabs start their natural decline, the duo really won't matter much. We have nothing coming to replace them, so we have to strike now. 

When stan said "I have to be better, and I will be better". I truly believe that he was referring to him signing Panera early. He screwed up with that, and the kid proved he's not going to be worth it in the end. With Cap space this team will be alright for the short term, but without it, you'll get a little better result than this year. Too many holes in this team, and I don't mean regular season holes. My fear is the team as is will do much better during the regular season, and still have the same results in the first round, but score more in the first round. We can't wait forever for guys like Panera to show up. Once their paid, they have to play like it, and he clearly isn't worth what he's paid. Take him away from Kane, and his numbers slip. He's too one dimensional to pay that kind of money too!!!

Absolutely. One of his dumbest moves yet. He very easily could have waited until the off-season.

I remember saying that, depending on where the Hawks where at come the deadline, they should entertain the thought of trading him -- but that was around the time of their hot streak, so I can't fault Bowman there; but he should have waited. I also remember saying that, Panarin needs to prove that he can be flexible in the lineup; that he can be a swing-man between lines, that he can carry a line, and that he can play away from Patrick Kane. None of this has been confirmed. I thought perhaps it would be by the time the season/playoffs were over (another reason for Bowman to have waited), but we don't know: we don't know if he can perform in the playoffs and we don't know if he can play away from the 2nd line/Kane.

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Granada said on 6 hours ago:

Absolutely. One of his dumbest moves yet. He very easily could have waited until the off-season.

I remember saying that, depending on where the Hawks where at come the deadline, they should entertain the thought of trading him -- but that was around the time of their hot streak, so I can't fault Bowman there; but he should have waited. I also remember saying that, Panarin needs to prove that he can be flexible in the lineup; that he can be a swing-man between lines, that he can carry a line, and that he can play away from Patrick Kane. None of this has been confirmed. I thought perhaps it would be by the time the season/playoffs were over (another reason for Bowman to have waited), but we don't know: we don't know if he can perform in the playoffs and we don't know if he can play away from the 2nd line/Kane.

Was it one of his dumbest moves yet or was it a smart move to lock him up at that cap in order to trade him this off season.  Moving him with a contract like that may be attractive to a team that can absorb the cap hit and have him locked up for those years.  Question for me is what would come back in return for him.  TB?  Colorado?  

I think time tells if it was dumb or smart.

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iknowpuck said on 13 hours ago:

Was it one of his dumbest moves yet or was it a smart move to lock him up at that cap in order to trade him this off season.  Moving him with a contract like that may be attractive to a team that can absorb the cap hit and have him locked up for those years.  Question for me is what would come back in return for him.  TB?  Colorado?  

I think time tells if it was dumb or smart.

 

The contract amount is definitely on target for a guy who has scored 30 goals in the two seasons he has been in the league and in or near the top ten in total scoring.     Yes there are questions about playoff performance based on this year, which the team threw the turd, but last year he was pretty effective.    So I do think it is an attractive contract for someone, especially since the off-season could have proved to be higher for teams that need his skill and have the cap.

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iknowpuck said on 17 hours ago:

Was it one of his dumbest moves yet or was it a smart move to lock him up at that cap in order to trade him this off season.  Moving him with a contract like that may be attractive to a team that can absorb the cap hit and have him locked up for those years.  Question for me is what would come back in return for him.  TB?  Colorado?  

I think time tells if it was dumb or smart.

I see your point, but I'd still say dumb, considering the cap crunch this team was and is in when the contract was given and the fact that, it isn't always a sure thing that you can trade a player. I don't think Bowman would risk that; at least I would hope he wouldn't risk that, in regard to this and similar situations.

Edited by Granada
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Granada said on 3 hours ago:

I see your point, but I'd still say dumb, considering the cap crunch this team was and is in when the contract was given and the fact that, it isn't always a sure thing that you can trade a player. I don't think Bowman would risk that; at least I would hope he wouldn't risk that, in regard to this and similar situations.

I think it's dumb just cuz we don't even know where the cap will be, plus he has bonus's to factor in, not just Panera, but Campbell, and a couple of the rookies have bonus's that count against next years cap. So what ever the cap goes up, it's already spent, and then some. So losing Paneras 6 million may be the proper way to go, plus Kruger will have to be dealt or nabbed. I still feel to better the team, we will need to lose even more salary, CC, AA, Panera, and Kruger should all be gone, that's 20 millionish to play with. Or take back salary. 

You can bet that LA is gonna go hard after Thornton and Marleau for another kick at the can. Yes it's short term, but they should be our targets. Deal AA and Panera plus a prospect like Motte for cap relief, Duchene, and Landeskog. And let those two become 2nd tier scoring for us, and they'll be better off, rather than being the primary scoring for a bad Team!!!

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 ^ I agree with you completely about Panarin and the bonuses next year. I also agree that Kruger and CC need to be moved; and I don't fault you for wanting AA and Panarin gone, although I don't think Bowman makes that drastic a move personally. I can see him maybe moving AA alone. I like the idea of Landeskog and especially Duchene too. 

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Granada said on 1 minute ago:

 ^ I agree with you completely about Panarin and the bonuses next year. I also agree that Kruger and CC need to be moved; and I don't fault you for wanting AA and Panarin gone, although I don't think Bowman makes that drastic a move personally. I can see him maybe moving AA alone. I like the idea of Landeskog and especially Duchene too. 

I still feel that Stan won't do much. My guess is, he lets all the UFAs walk. And that's his dramatic move. He may also be looking for a reason to fire Q. This will give him time to hang around, and then finally make the moves that need to be made with a coach he owns. This way, Q only has another year and a bit on his deal, rather than 2 years. I just don't see Q lasting much longer. At some point his message gets old and a change is needed. Look at the Pens!!!

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^ Agreed. The writing on the wall has begun for Q. Whether or not that's right or not is always the question, but either way, that's the way it goes: coaches are hired to be fired, so the saying goes.

You're probably right on Bowman too. I hope he can at least trade Crow (and Kruger, but I digress) and sign Darling as a starter; that is a no-brainer move, assuming he can actually make a deal that makes sense and there's a team that wants to eat that salary if there's a sweetner like Motte or even Schmaltz involved. 

Edited by Granada
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iknowpuck said on On 4/25/2017 at 8:32 PM:

SB needs to make major changes...if he can.  Fan love is over.  It's about winning.  The window to win more cups isn't as clean as it looked 2 years ago.

A little Windex should clean the window

 

 

 

Now is there someone named Blue Windex available in the draft? :P

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Granada said on 28 minutes ago:

^ Agreed. The writing on the wall has begun for Q. Whether or not that's right or not is always the question, but either way, that's the way it goes: coaches are hired to be fired, so the saying goes.

You're probably right on Bowman too. I hope he can at least trade Crow (and Kruger, but I digress) and sign Darling as a starter; that is a no-brainer move, assuming he can actually make a deal that makes sense and there's a team that wants to eat that salary if there's a sweetner like Motte or even Schmaltz involved. 

Or it is the more than subtle hint that I've done the best I could for you and your ways for many years while trying to get this cap crap under control and now it's your turn to try it my way.

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What I'd like to see is the "newer" core be brought in little by little. Whether it's someone in the system, or someone elsewhere. MVR brought up a valid target in Hannafin. He could be the next Seabrook? But we need to bring in the understudies of a lot of our guys. And I'm not sure that Panera is the guy we want being a part of our core group moving forward. I'd trade Schmaltz for Hannafin, or another developing player. But we need to get the next wave we're gonna keep for a long while. I don't see how we can continue the way we're going by overpaying aging icons and trading away everything in system for guys that never get used. It's basically a scorched earth policy!!!

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vipermuscle83 said on On 4/25/2017 at 0:59 PM:

I keep asking myself, are things really that bad?  I'm seeing guys calling for Panarin to be traded, saying that no one is untouchable, etc.  Guys, we had 109 points.  You can't just dismiss that regardless of what went wrong in the playoffs.  Now, what I will say is that we need to get A LOT younger.  After the trade deadline last year, we were the oldest team in the NHL.  Now THAT was evident in the playoffs.  There's been a lack of young and speedy grinders on this team.  Those are the guys you need to win board battles and get dirty goals in front of the crease.  Too much finesse, not enough sandpaper has been the issue the last couple years.  The league is evolving, and big guys can still have skill and speed nowadays.  We can't keep drafting and trading for these sub 6 foot players that are all skill and no will.  

We need to shed salary in areas where we have strength and depth.  Trading Panarin is idiotic.  He is exactly what this team is lacking more of.  He's extremely skilled, but he's hard-nosed and feisty.  He's been our most productive player after Kane.  Guys like Kane, Toews, Keith, Seabrook, Hammer and Hossa are either untouchable due to importance to the team or because they have zero trade value.  You can trade away anyone else on the roster, but chances are they don't make much and won't give you the flexibility you need.  That's why I'm a big believer in Crawford being the only true big money trade chip that you've got at this point.  He's expendable for 2 reasons:

A.  He's a goalie and Bowmans believe a goaltender is the product of a team in front of him

B.  There's a number 2 guy behind him that's more than sufficient as a number 1, and Darling can be signed for $3.5mill or under

I know I keep harping on this Crawford thing.  It's because I believe that this one trade plus whoever we lose to LV plus dropping the older UFAs this summer will lead to enough flexibility to really fix what's wrong with this team in the short-term.  In the long-term, we need to change our drafting mentality to evolve with the changing game of hockey.  Big players with speed and skill.

Look at the Canucks and tell me if you are happy with 109 points. They won the presidents trophy they are now bottom feeders for a while and have really won nothing but had some good points at the end of the some seasons. When the Hawks play tough teams the get scared they and mostly kaner play scared and just shut  down. The D also can't take tough forechecking teams they all become turn over machines. 

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Granada said on 17 hours ago:

I see your point, but I'd still say dumb, considering the cap crunch this team was and is in when the contract was given and the fact that, it isn't always a sure thing that you can trade a player. I don't think Bowman would risk that; at least I would hope he wouldn't risk that, in regard to this and similar situations.

Would you trade Panarin to Edmonton for Maroon?  Other pieces involved both ways if necessary.

He can't trade Panarin's cap for another high priced contract.  He needs to gain cap relief.

That may seem crazy but deals like that (I stress like that) is what SB may need to make.

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